Wu, as spoken in Shanghai, has five tones. Standard Mandarin has four. Cantonese has six. In each case there are dialects which differ.
I remember reading once that Vietnamese was a seven-tone language, and the reason French had been quickly adopted and hung on so long was that little kids could use that while they were figuring out Vietnamese. I have no idea if any of that's true.
If we had more cross-disciplinary appointments and more interdisciplinary collaboration, we’d probably have better structures in place for working through these sorts of blind spots and assumptions.... Alas, that is not the model on which academia currently runs.
My last position during my technical career was a research job where everyone just assumed I must have a PhD. Occasionally this came up at lunchtime discussions. At one of those, one of the people who did have a doctorate made the observation that yes, Mike had done multiple projects that would easily qualify for a PhD in terms of originality and impact, but all cut across multiple disciplines so no department would ever accept them.
I just found out one of my college roommates passed away late last night/early this morning. It wasn't a surprise. He had metastatic cancer and it was clear that he was nearing the end.
I hadn't seen or heard from him for roughly 30 years until about a month ago when his brother called me out of the blue to let me know the situation and to invite me to a birthday party he was throwing for him early this month. In the last month, I spoke with my former roommate on the phone a few times and went to see him three times - once at the party and twice at his house.
My wife finally got to meet him at his birthday party after hearing stories about him for years from me and other mutual friends who I did stay in touch with. He was the only one out of our tighter circle of friends that she hadn't met. She would joke that he was like Norm Peterson's wife, Vera, on "Cheers" (or Niles's wife, Mariss, on "Frasier") who never made an appearance on screen, leaving you to wonder if she really existed.
Even minus 100 pounds and in a wheelchair, he was still the same charming, funny, and engaging guy. He and my wife might as well have been lifelong friends after five minutes.
There was never any reason that we lost touch for so long other than that we simply got caught up in our lives in ways that had him in a different place than the rest of us. He was kind of an enigmatic guy who would go in whatever direction without looking back, though he did express regret about losing touch for so long once we all got back together. And, once we did, it was like no time had passed. We might as well have been back in college hanging out in the crappy apartment we all lived in together.
I'm not fishing for condolences with this comment. I just wanted to share something that I think illustrates the weird poignancy that life occasionally throws at you unexpectedly. It's like there was this significant part of my existence that had long been dormant but suddenly woke up to take hold of me and become, at least for a time, the most important focus of my personal life.
I can't find the word for it, but it's something like "heady," only without the thrill, maybe with a bit of "mind-f**k" thrown in.
It seems like the assumption of a shared language base actually rests on two factors: race, and a largely shared script. Neither of which really impact language.
For race, only consider Swedish, Hungarian, Spanish, and Ukranian. The Europeans who are native speakers of those languages are all the same race. But the languages are not related.
As for a shared script, note that the Latin script is used not only for all of the languages of Western and Northern Europe, but for the hundreds of languages of pretty much all of Sub-Saharan Africa, not to mention Vietnamese. The linguistic overlap is basically nonexistant (barring loan words, of course).
Sure, it would be convenient if learning Japanese was relevant to learning Korean or Chinese (either Mandarin or Cantonese, or one of the other "dialects" -- actually distinct languages rather than real dialects). But while all use related scripts, the spoken languages, as you discovered, are quite different. Just to state the obvious, Chinese is a tonal** language, which Japanese is definitely not. (I'm not familiar enough with Korean to know which, if either, it resembles.)
** In case anyone here is unfamiliar with the term, the only example in English is the use a rising tone in the last syllable of a sentence to indicate a question. The meaning of the word isn't changed. In contrast, Chinese uses 5 (IIRC) different tones to differentiate unrelated words. See the chart here for examples.
I think this is a particular problem for academics specializing in East Asia because of the problem I faced: Getting fluent in one language/culture is tough, in two is exponentially tougher and three requires something on the level of cosmic coincidence.
I'm not discounting the specific language challenges that you identify here. I suspect the same can be said of linguists that are attempting to do comparative study between geographically distant and isolated branches of Indo-European - leaning too hard on the common ground of shared language and not doing enough to understand the divergent histories, local influences, and historical contexts of the moments they are comparing. These complexities are difficult to work through and require multiple bridging assumptions.
On a more general level, though, I think that the disciplinary specialization of university departments and the specialist communities that form around these disciplinary homes may also lead to another form of overestimation of individual expertise and critical perspective. Scholars submit their work to specialist journals, and the editors on those journals share methodological approaches and disciplinary identities with most of the people submitting papers for publication. And even if the paper does get submitted to an outside expert to verify parts that are outside of the author's expertise, those outside experts often find themselves in unfamiliar methodologies and contexts that limit how much they are able to interact with the wider implications of what is being asserted in the article.
If we had more cross-disciplinary appointments and more interdisciplinary collaboration, we'd probably have better structures in place for working through these sorts of blind spots and assumptions.
Alas, that is not the model on which academia currently runs.
russell, the critical phrase there was "by comparison.". I don't think that, in any absolute sense, it will be quick or easy. I just think that the foreign relations impact will be harder and slower to repair. In part because they can decline to join us in anything, whereas we are basically stuck with each other. (The dreams of Steven Miller, et al. notwithstanding.)
I don't think we can save America from fascism without somehow countering the firehose of Goebbels style propaganda from Faux, Newsmax, and other Republican media outlets. Trump will stroke out, but the rest of the R party will remain. I don't see it as a Trump cult as much as it is a Faux news cult.
Job security is one of the attractive things about working for the government at a lower salary than you likely would in the private sector. So much for that.
The rebuilding at home will be, by comparison with the destruction of trust, be quick and easy.
I wish I shared your optimism here, but unfortunately I do not.
The problem I see is that all the people who are more than fine with what's going on now are still gonna be here. They might not be an absolute majority, but there are a lot of them, and the non-democratic aspects of our polity - the Senate, the Electoral College - give them political clout beyond what their numbers would merit.
And a lot of the people who Trump and the conservative movement in general have brought into government are still gonna be there. Especially in the judiciary, not to exclude the SCOTUS. Roberts, Alito, Thomas are all 70 or older, but Kavanaugh, Gorsuch, and Coney Barrett all have decades of time ahead of them.
To add to that, I think the Trump years are gonna make the professional civil service - the people who actually do the governmenty stuff - a much less attractive option for people who might otherwise be interested in basic public service.
If every four years you're gonna have to worry about having to explain to some 20-something techbro asshole why what you do - monitoring economic and labor data, tracking the weather, medical research, etc. - is important enough to justify your continued employment is gonna make a lot of people look elsewhere.
Some folks who have been RIF'd would probably go back, a lot will not. And I can't blame them.
wj, you provoke me to trot out one of my favorite dictums once again:
The optimist thinks we live in the best of all possible worlds.
The pessimist fears this may be true.
I know, I know: you're not saying we live in the best of all possible worlds, since your optimism amounts to saying that a better world might arise from the ashes of the current debacle. Do you think we will live long enough to see it?
I give the possibility less than even odds, myself, because I don't see how we get there without a lot of fuss and bother. Maybe civil-war-level fuss and bother, because deMAGAfication will be fiercely resisted by the anti-anti-fascists. And it's not clear that deMAGAfication would even be on the agenda if the Democrats ever regain power.
"Look forward, not back" they will say again. "The MAGAts stole the SCOTUS fair and square" they will mumble. "Fire the army of yahoos who signed up to be ICE 'agents'? Tut, tut, there are civil service rules, you know" will be their position. They will not uproot and incinerate the poison ivy planted among the hydrangeas by the MAGAts, is what I'm saying.
Maybe, with "a lot of work", you can take back the GOP and I can put some backbone into the Democratic Party, but I have my doubts on both fronts. And I'm not even sure what the actual "work" would have to be.
Well, at least I managed yesterday to install a motion-activated porch light for the benefit of my mailman, who will soon be trying to find the mail slot in my front door after dark.
There are times when it's a great coping mechanism to be a compulsive optimist. Although that should probably be a *relative* optimist.
I expect the nation will take a lot (more) damage in the near term. But I think it is, eventually, recoverable damage. Not without a lot of work. And in a lot of cases, it will probably take a couple of generations for the memories to fade. Definitely, in the case of our foreign relations.
But consider our relations (pre-Trump!) with Germany and Japan. Economic competitors to some degree, sure. But even the oldest of us are only the children of the folks who fought World War II, and it's never had the same emotional impact that it did for them. For us, it's just history; for our children it's mostly ancient history.
The rebuilding at home will be, by comparison with the destruction of trust, be quick and easy. Relatively. Lots and lots of people hurt in the meantime. But horrible as that is, overall it's a long way from "permanent".
And (see compulsive optimist) I could see us getting to something resembling the Progressive Era that followed the previous Gilded Age. Not just fixing the trashed stuff, by completely new improvements.
Latest birthday doodle using some of the "little monster" characters from the fairy tale. These have a family business as "The World's Greatest Spies." They all wear an eye patch over their left eye whether they need it or not.
I had a cavity filled today. Four hours on from when they started, my upper lip on that side is still numb. Ah, the joys of trying to drink from a glass when you can only feel it on one side.
"it’s something I can do without having to rely on a functioning government to sustain it"
this ^^^
I'm sure it's obvious from my comments here over the years that I'm fine with an active government.
But the government we have right now is profoundly toxic.
We need to resist all of that wherever we can, to the degree that we can, with whatever resources we can bring to that effort. But turning all of that around, for whatever meaning of "turn that around" manifests itself, will take time. And a lot of government-y stuff is going to be broken, and some it will stay broken indefinitely, perhaps forever.
So it's important to find other avenues for, as the cliche has it, making the world a better place. Which mostly amounts to helping each other and not shitting on the given world we all live in. Or, you know, trying our best to do those things.
The federal government we have right now is effectively a cabal of greedy vindictive malicious wanna-be tyrants. Most of them are deeply incompetent, and the ones that aren't we probably wish were.
Find ways to work around them. Get in their way if you can, to whatever degree of risk you can tolerate. Which might be none, which is OK. But find ways to do constructive things in spite of them.
I'm surprised that the formalized concept of Euclidean rhythms didn't come about until 2004. It's like someone just last week being the first to recognize that people sit on chairs.
This may sound weird, but one thing I have been doing is planting trees. Not personally. We're in an apartment in campus managed housing, so our ability to do much of anything with our surroundings is highly limited. Nope, I've been donating monthly to One Tree Planted for most of the year, and they have been doing the planting for me in areas devastated by wildfires or desertification. By the end of the year I'll have planted 240 trees around the world.
It's a small thing, but it's something I can do without having to rely on a functioning government to sustain it, and it directly contributes to slowing down the damage we are doing with our other shortsightedness.
For the last week or two I've been dealing with water infiltration and resulting black mold in the basement. Which has been, to a surprising and welcome degree, a great way to keep from feeling overwhelmed by all of the Trumpian BS.
It's a tractable problem, and I can fix it. Tear out bad sheetrock and insulation, bag it up and throw it out. Treat the remaining nasty spots. Hang new insulation and sheetrock. Tape prep and paint.
All done! All better! It's actually been kind of therapeutic.
Household chores, same. Pruning, fall cleanup. I've been putting peanuts out for the crows, who have figured out my schedule and arrive more or less on time each morning in a kind of raucous crowd. Gonna put the feeders up for the songbirds this weekend.
Listen to music, play music. Stay in touch with friends. Be mindful of my own reactions to events, emotionally physically and spiritually, and step away when it begins to overwhelm.
It will, for better or worse, still be there when you feel up to dealing with it.
I was volunteering at a local food bank, but stopped back in June when I got COVID. Now I just send them money, but it's actually much more satisfying to contribute in person. So I may go back to that once I finish getting the basement cleaned up.
There is a limit to what any one of us can absorb, and to what any one of us can do about it all. Recognize and respect your own limits. That doesn't mean put your head in the sand and pretend nothing bad is happening, it just means don't let it run you over.
You're doing all good things, wonkie. It's an inspiration to me, personally. Carry on, and take care of yourself.
I feel pretty much the same as wonkie just upthread. Maybe it's age-related in me, I can hear the clave when it is isolated out, but actually in the music I don't hear it. On the other hand, that doesn't stop me really enjoying the music, and if I didn't feel so under the weather I might even have danced around the room a bit!
On “Ramsayer, Korea and me”
Wu, as spoken in Shanghai, has five tones. Standard Mandarin has four. Cantonese has six. In each case there are dialects which differ.
I remember reading once that Vietnamese was a seven-tone language, and the reason French had been quickly adopted and hung on so long was that little kids could use that while they were figuring out Vietnamese. I have no idea if any of that's true.
"
If we had more cross-disciplinary appointments and more interdisciplinary collaboration, we’d probably have better structures in place for working through these sorts of blind spots and assumptions.... Alas, that is not the model on which academia currently runs.
My last position during my technical career was a research job where everyone just assumed I must have a PhD. Occasionally this came up at lunchtime discussions. At one of those, one of the people who did have a doctorate made the observation that yes, Mike had done multiple projects that would easily qualify for a PhD in terms of originality and impact, but all cut across multiple disciplines so no department would ever accept them.
On “I got depressed so I bought hydrangeas”
I just found out one of my college roommates passed away late last night/early this morning. It wasn't a surprise. He had metastatic cancer and it was clear that he was nearing the end.
I hadn't seen or heard from him for roughly 30 years until about a month ago when his brother called me out of the blue to let me know the situation and to invite me to a birthday party he was throwing for him early this month. In the last month, I spoke with my former roommate on the phone a few times and went to see him three times - once at the party and twice at his house.
My wife finally got to meet him at his birthday party after hearing stories about him for years from me and other mutual friends who I did stay in touch with. He was the only one out of our tighter circle of friends that she hadn't met. She would joke that he was like Norm Peterson's wife, Vera, on "Cheers" (or Niles's wife, Mariss, on "Frasier") who never made an appearance on screen, leaving you to wonder if she really existed.
Even minus 100 pounds and in a wheelchair, he was still the same charming, funny, and engaging guy. He and my wife might as well have been lifelong friends after five minutes.
There was never any reason that we lost touch for so long other than that we simply got caught up in our lives in ways that had him in a different place than the rest of us. He was kind of an enigmatic guy who would go in whatever direction without looking back, though he did express regret about losing touch for so long once we all got back together. And, once we did, it was like no time had passed. We might as well have been back in college hanging out in the crappy apartment we all lived in together.
I'm not fishing for condolences with this comment. I just wanted to share something that I think illustrates the weird poignancy that life occasionally throws at you unexpectedly. It's like there was this significant part of my existence that had long been dormant but suddenly woke up to take hold of me and become, at least for a time, the most important focus of my personal life.
I can't find the word for it, but it's something like "heady," only without the thrill, maybe with a bit of "mind-f**k" thrown in.
On “Ramsayer, Korea and me”
Wu, as spoken in Shanghai, has five tones. Standard Mandarin has four. Cantonese has six. In each case there are dialects which differ.
"
It seems like the assumption of a shared language base actually rests on two factors: race, and a largely shared script. Neither of which really impact language.
For race, only consider Swedish, Hungarian, Spanish, and Ukranian. The Europeans who are native speakers of those languages are all the same race. But the languages are not related.
As for a shared script, note that the Latin script is used not only for all of the languages of Western and Northern Europe, but for the hundreds of languages of pretty much all of Sub-Saharan Africa, not to mention Vietnamese. The linguistic overlap is basically nonexistant (barring loan words, of course).
Sure, it would be convenient if learning Japanese was relevant to learning Korean or Chinese (either Mandarin or Cantonese, or one of the other "dialects" -- actually distinct languages rather than real dialects). But while all use related scripts, the spoken languages, as you discovered, are quite different. Just to state the obvious, Chinese is a tonal** language, which Japanese is definitely not. (I'm not familiar enough with Korean to know which, if either, it resembles.)
** In case anyone here is unfamiliar with the term, the only example in English is the use a rising tone in the last syllable of a sentence to indicate a question. The meaning of the word isn't changed. In contrast, Chinese uses 5 (IIRC) different tones to differentiate unrelated words. See the chart here for examples.
"
I'm not discounting the specific language challenges that you identify here. I suspect the same can be said of linguists that are attempting to do comparative study between geographically distant and isolated branches of Indo-European - leaning too hard on the common ground of shared language and not doing enough to understand the divergent histories, local influences, and historical contexts of the moments they are comparing. These complexities are difficult to work through and require multiple bridging assumptions.
On a more general level, though, I think that the disciplinary specialization of university departments and the specialist communities that form around these disciplinary homes may also lead to another form of overestimation of individual expertise and critical perspective. Scholars submit their work to specialist journals, and the editors on those journals share methodological approaches and disciplinary identities with most of the people submitting papers for publication. And even if the paper does get submitted to an outside expert to verify parts that are outside of the author's expertise, those outside experts often find themselves in unfamiliar methodologies and contexts that limit how much they are able to interact with the wider implications of what is being asserted in the article.
If we had more cross-disciplinary appointments and more interdisciplinary collaboration, we'd probably have better structures in place for working through these sorts of blind spots and assumptions.
Alas, that is not the model on which academia currently runs.
On “I got depressed so I bought hydrangeas”
russell, the critical phrase there was "by comparison.". I don't think that, in any absolute sense, it will be quick or easy. I just think that the foreign relations impact will be harder and slower to repair. In part because they can decline to join us in anything, whereas we are basically stuck with each other. (The dreams of Steven Miller, et al. notwithstanding.)
"
I don't think we can save America from fascism without somehow countering the firehose of Goebbels style propaganda from Faux, Newsmax, and other Republican media outlets. Trump will stroke out, but the rest of the R party will remain. I don't see it as a Trump cult as much as it is a Faux news cult.
"
Job security is one of the attractive things about working for the government at a lower salary than you likely would in the private sector. So much for that.
"
The rebuilding at home will be, by comparison with the destruction of trust, be quick and easy.
I wish I shared your optimism here, but unfortunately I do not.
The problem I see is that all the people who are more than fine with what's going on now are still gonna be here. They might not be an absolute majority, but there are a lot of them, and the non-democratic aspects of our polity - the Senate, the Electoral College - give them political clout beyond what their numbers would merit.
And a lot of the people who Trump and the conservative movement in general have brought into government are still gonna be there. Especially in the judiciary, not to exclude the SCOTUS. Roberts, Alito, Thomas are all 70 or older, but Kavanaugh, Gorsuch, and Coney Barrett all have decades of time ahead of them.
To add to that, I think the Trump years are gonna make the professional civil service - the people who actually do the governmenty stuff - a much less attractive option for people who might otherwise be interested in basic public service.
If every four years you're gonna have to worry about having to explain to some 20-something techbro asshole why what you do - monitoring economic and labor data, tracking the weather, medical research, etc. - is important enough to justify your continued employment is gonna make a lot of people look elsewhere.
Some folks who have been RIF'd would probably go back, a lot will not. And I can't blame them.
"
wj, you provoke me to trot out one of my favorite dictums once again:
I know, I know: you're not saying we live in the best of all possible worlds, since your optimism amounts to saying that a better world might arise from the ashes of the current debacle. Do you think we will live long enough to see it?
I give the possibility less than even odds, myself, because I don't see how we get there without a lot of fuss and bother. Maybe civil-war-level fuss and bother, because deMAGAfication will be fiercely resisted by the anti-anti-fascists. And it's not clear that deMAGAfication would even be on the agenda if the Democrats ever regain power.
"Look forward, not back" they will say again. "The MAGAts stole the SCOTUS fair and square" they will mumble. "Fire the army of yahoos who signed up to be ICE 'agents'? Tut, tut, there are civil service rules, you know" will be their position. They will not uproot and incinerate the poison ivy planted among the hydrangeas by the MAGAts, is what I'm saying.
Maybe, with "a lot of work", you can take back the GOP and I can put some backbone into the Democratic Party, but I have my doubts on both fronts. And I'm not even sure what the actual "work" would have to be.
Well, at least I managed yesterday to install a motion-activated porch light for the benefit of my mailman, who will soon be trying to find the mail slot in my front door after dark.
--TP
"
There are times when it's a great coping mechanism to be a compulsive optimist. Although that should probably be a *relative* optimist.
I expect the nation will take a lot (more) damage in the near term. But I think it is, eventually, recoverable damage. Not without a lot of work. And in a lot of cases, it will probably take a couple of generations for the memories to fade. Definitely, in the case of our foreign relations.
But consider our relations (pre-Trump!) with Germany and Japan. Economic competitors to some degree, sure. But even the oldest of us are only the children of the folks who fought World War II, and it's never had the same emotional impact that it did for them. For us, it's just history; for our children it's mostly ancient history.
The rebuilding at home will be, by comparison with the destruction of trust, be quick and easy. Relatively. Lots and lots of people hurt in the meantime. But horrible as that is, overall it's a long way from "permanent".
And (see compulsive optimist) I could see us getting to something resembling the Progressive Era that followed the previous Gilded Age. Not just fixing the trashed stuff, by completely new improvements.
"
Latest birthday doodle using some of the "little monster" characters from the fairy tale. These have a family business as "The World's Greatest Spies." They all wear an eye patch over their left eye whether they need it or not.
"
...going numb...
I had a cavity filled today. Four hours on from when they started, my upper lip on that side is still numb. Ah, the joys of trying to drink from a glass when you can only feel it on one side.
"
last few weeks i've learned that i cope by a combination of going numb and keeping busy as a distraction.
doing? utterly awful.
someday i'll share why.
"
"it’s something I can do without having to rely on a functioning government to sustain it"
this ^^^
I'm sure it's obvious from my comments here over the years that I'm fine with an active government.
But the government we have right now is profoundly toxic.
We need to resist all of that wherever we can, to the degree that we can, with whatever resources we can bring to that effort. But turning all of that around, for whatever meaning of "turn that around" manifests itself, will take time. And a lot of government-y stuff is going to be broken, and some it will stay broken indefinitely, perhaps forever.
So it's important to find other avenues for, as the cliche has it, making the world a better place. Which mostly amounts to helping each other and not shitting on the given world we all live in. Or, you know, trying our best to do those things.
The federal government we have right now is effectively a cabal of greedy vindictive malicious wanna-be tyrants. Most of them are deeply incompetent, and the ones that aren't we probably wish were.
Find ways to work around them. Get in their way if you can, to whatever degree of risk you can tolerate. Which might be none, which is OK. But find ways to do constructive things in spite of them.
That's how we get through.
On “Weekend music thread #03 Rhumba and the clave”
I'm surprised that the formalized concept of Euclidean rhythms didn't come about until 2004. It's like someone just last week being the first to recognize that people sit on chairs.
On “I got depressed so I bought hydrangeas”
This may sound weird, but one thing I have been doing is planting trees. Not personally. We're in an apartment in campus managed housing, so our ability to do much of anything with our surroundings is highly limited. Nope, I've been donating monthly to One Tree Planted for most of the year, and they have been doing the planting for me in areas devastated by wildfires or desertification. By the end of the year I'll have planted 240 trees around the world.
It's a small thing, but it's something I can do without having to rely on a functioning government to sustain it, and it directly contributes to slowing down the damage we are doing with our other shortsightedness.
On “Weekend music thread #03 Rhumba and the clave”
And here’s Sepultura in their full Afro Caribbean mode back in 1996
CDs are very durable, because I should have worn all the bits off my "Roots" CD years ago.
On “I got depressed so I bought hydrangeas”
For the last week or two I've been dealing with water infiltration and resulting black mold in the basement. Which has been, to a surprising and welcome degree, a great way to keep from feeling overwhelmed by all of the Trumpian BS.
It's a tractable problem, and I can fix it. Tear out bad sheetrock and insulation, bag it up and throw it out. Treat the remaining nasty spots. Hang new insulation and sheetrock. Tape prep and paint.
All done! All better! It's actually been kind of therapeutic.
Household chores, same. Pruning, fall cleanup. I've been putting peanuts out for the crows, who have figured out my schedule and arrive more or less on time each morning in a kind of raucous crowd. Gonna put the feeders up for the songbirds this weekend.
Listen to music, play music. Stay in touch with friends. Be mindful of my own reactions to events, emotionally physically and spiritually, and step away when it begins to overwhelm.
It will, for better or worse, still be there when you feel up to dealing with it.
I was volunteering at a local food bank, but stopped back in June when I got COVID. Now I just send them money, but it's actually much more satisfying to contribute in person. So I may go back to that once I finish getting the basement cleaned up.
There is a limit to what any one of us can absorb, and to what any one of us can do about it all. Recognize and respect your own limits. That doesn't mean put your head in the sand and pretend nothing bad is happening, it just means don't let it run you over.
You're doing all good things, wonkie. It's an inspiration to me, personally. Carry on, and take care of yourself.
"
This was supposed to go up a day earlier, but I got confused with the date line. Thanks and apologies wonkie!
My confession is that I really don't know anything about flowers. Though I am a big fan of Candide...
On “Something Different”
Thank you. There's probably a camera store in Olympia too.
On “Weekend music thread #03 Rhumba and the clave”
I feel pretty much the same as wonkie just upthread. Maybe it's age-related in me, I can hear the clave when it is isolated out, but actually in the music I don't hear it. On the other hand, that doesn't stop me really enjoying the music, and if I didn't feel so under the weather I might even have danced around the room a bit!
"
And here's Sepultura in their full Afro Caribbean mode back in 1996:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YUJit9iNE0
"
russell - https://www.invisibleoranges.com/opeth-bembe/
*Comment archive for non-registered commenters assembled by email address as provided.