by liberal japonicus
I was a bit surprised to see Ezra Klein interviewing James Talarico, who is running for the Senate seat of Texas currently occupied by John Coryn, but after listening, I can see that Talarico hits some of Klein’s sweet spots.
Some things about where I’m coming from on this. Because I didn’t pay much attention, I had some baggage. I had heard that Jasmine Crockett was running for the seat and I thought that Talarico was being put forward as a big tent Democrat (He’s Christian! He’s white!), but on checking, Talarico declared his candidacy on Sept 25 and was running against Colin Allred, who withdrew from the race to run in Crockett’s old seat when Crockett announced her candidacy in December. So I wonder what calculations are being made by the Texas Democrats on this, bearing in mind Will Rogers line of ‘I don’t belong to any organized political party. I’m a Democrat’.
Talarico’s view of Christianity and politics seems much more of a fit with Klein’s outlook, which, coupled with the fact that Talarico appeared on Joe Rogan, had Klein invite him. (It’s hard for me to imagine Klein inviting Crockett) I also see a turn to the spiritual in Klein, (he just had on Stephen Batchelor, the author Buddha, Socrates, and Us: Ethical Living in Uncertain Times, which was interesting, but seemed indicative) and Talarico gives that warm, fuzzy feeling about how we have to rise above our differences, which Klein laps up. I also see it in Klein’s ill-advised encomium to Charlie Kirk (he discusses that with Te-nehesi Coates here) I uncharitably imagine that Jasmine Crockett won’t be making an appearance any time soon.
Anyway, listening to Talarico is interesting and I like some of his arguments, though towards the end, I felt it was the whole ‘I will work with anyone’ which is often held up as a shibboleth, was a bit shtick-y. Anyway, curious what others may think.
I like Talarico. He entered the race before Crockett, so no conspiracy against her by evil white liberals–despite the rumors on Bluesky. I think Talarico’s reclaiming of Christianity is hugely beneficial. Also, he is clear spoken and makes the moral issues front and center–the morality of Dem policies and the immorality of so many Texas Republican actions and policies. He isn’t defensive. He is attacking and moving the Overton Window.
I like Crockett, too, but I don’t think she has the ability to change the terms of the conversation the way Talarico can.
That change in the terms of the convo seems important since it is unlikely that either will win a Senate seat. The goal needs to be to change TX politics over the long term by changing hearts and minds and that means reframing perceptions.
Of course I don’t live there, so I won’t be voting and likely don’t have sufficient local knowledge to support my opinions.
I had to chase down a transcript because I refuse to give over an hour of time to what is at best 15 minutes of substance.
I like Talarico as a Christian reformer. He’s speaking for a lot of the values that used to be present in evangelicalism back before it was radicalized by anti-abortion rhetoric. I also like his ability to use the language of Christianity against the Christian nationalists. And I think he’s good at speaking to non-Democrats in a way that makes them feel as if they have been heard and understood, and been treated with compassion.
I’m not sure, however, that his approach to things is going to move the needle on immigration or on social justice for minorities. I think his framing and appeals mostly decenter any conversation about those things in meaningful detail and zoom out until those details become too fuzzy to register as things in the big picture. That’s not to say that he doesn’t care about or support those issues – I know he does – I’m just not sure that those issues can be addressed with the sort of compromises and conversations that he gives as examples of how to bring political opponents together.
I’ll start to pay more attention to Talarico when I start to see him opening up space for AOC to feature in the discussion.
Also, Klein talks too much and he is, for all of his talk about needing open discussion and bringing people together, really quite focused on elevating the aisle-crossers and code-switchers and trying to goad them into saying what is wrong with the disruptive progressives on their own side.
nous, just a quick note in case you didn’t know, you can pull a computer generated transcript off of youtube. I’ve been listening to this sort of stuff while I’m exercising, I certainly understand not wanting to waste time. I’ll go back and do that if there is a point I want to double check, copying it and dropping it into bbedit, though the formatting makes it tough sledding to read the whole thing. It’s ironic that while at the same time, instagram and tik-tok are trying to give us these concentrated bursts of info, it’s simultaneously accompanied by the podcasts that take 15 minutes of content and stretch it to an hour.
I agree with you about Klein, especially about him talking too much. He seems to be angling to be this generation’s Broder, whether he realizes it or not.
There’s a transcript at the NYT, which is what I used.
I’m always amazed at the people I know who post seven YT vids and two podcasts a day from some left-wing political influencer – many close to the same age as my students. Most of those are haphazardly arranged and not very cohesive, and more noise than signal.
I want information, and I want it to be accessible, not padded out for good engagement numbers and juiced for the outrage algorithm.
At least with a transcript I can skim and find the things that are worthwhile, and then use that to anchor my further reading.
At least with a transcript I can skim and find the things that are worthwhile, and then use that to anchor my further reading.
I just let Grok serve it up for me. 🙂
Progressive Christianity vs. Christian Nationalism
We know. You can also have them speaking to each other naked.
Or make them into giant house flies! Or cartoon penguins! So fun…
I think aging has affected my attention span. I CANNOT listen to videos. It seems like no one has the skill of getting concisely to the point. I can’t tolerate rambling, circling the point without landing the plane, or a long buildup of “context” that I already know. A video presentation should be like a persuasive essay: the thesis should be stated clearly at the outset.
wonkie, tell me about it. Unfortunately, when I find something I think is interesting to post, if it is at all timely, those are the kinds of things that I find have to cite. It also is shitty because I want to be careful about stating what people are saying, but the whole structure makes that difficult if you want to be careful. I’ll try and have the video start at the key point, but it is a pain.
indeed. i have the same problem with podcasts. i really want to have more of them to listen to, but i’m stuck with only three* because every other one i’ve tried has a speaker who can’t get to the point.
and podcasts / YT channels with more than one person are just torture – it seems like most of them are only there to make stupid jokes with each other.
i need a certain level of information density: not too low (most podcasts / channels) and not too high (i need to be able to follow it while devoting some attention to driving).
*
The History Of The English Language
Strong Songs
Sound Opinions – even though it’s two people, they have the ability to stick to the topic and not make it all about their cute nervous joking
LJ, I was not complaining about you or your posts! I appreciate you watching stuff so I don’t have to! And I appreciate you making posts.
People I love, respect and value keep sending me podcasts, videos etc which often last more than an hour. I feel like I absolutely cannot commit that kind of time (or even half that time) to something I know nothing about, no matter the recommender. That’s why I am incredibly grateful to anything that releases transcripts. I am a really fast reader, and take in information much more easily by means of text!
can someone point to a transcript? I don’t subscribe to the NYT but would be interested in reading. unfortunately I don’t have time to watch the podcast.
The Klein shows are available on NYT, if someone has a gift link, I’ll add it to the post.
For youtube stuff, click on the description just below and at the bottom of that, you’ll get a computer generated transcript. I’ve occasionally copied the whole transcript and then asked Gemini to format it so I can read it, though that is mostly with japanese stuff.
If you don’t have access to the NYTimes, you can find a transcript here:
https://podscripts.co/podcasts/the-ezra-klein-show/can-james-talarico-reclaim-christianity-for-the-left
…scroll down.
nous, ooo, nice catch! Thanks!
Thank you nous. The NYT “transcript” is a totally unformatted wall of text. You have to figure out from context who is speaking any given sentence.
I’ve been aware of both Talarico and Crockett for a while now. I like them both, and one reason I’m glad I don’t live in Texas is that I don’t have to chose between them in the primary.
Talarico’s Christian schtick (not disparaging it; just can’t think of a better word) may be exactly what’s needed to win a general election in Texas — or just what’s needed to raise false hopes again. I repeat what I’ve often said before: I’m done chasing “electability”, and anyway Texas Dems ought to be better judges of it than I am in this case.
I have a couple of reservations about explicit appeals to Christianity as a political strategy. First, it reinforces the lamentably wide-spread view that Christians have some sort of monopoly on decency. Second, I worry that Christ-like impulses like “judge not”, and “turn the other cheek”, and forgiveness of sins, may be impediments to the deMAGAfication the US sorely needs. But I absolutely accept that a Christian like Talarico is better able to weaken the support that Old Testament Christians have garnered from voters who think of themselves as devotees of Jesus.
–TP
This seems to be a pretty reasonable (if edited) and readable transcript of the Talarico interview. Gift link:
https://www.nytimes.com/2026/01/13/opinion/ezra-klein-podcast-james-talarico.html?unlocked_article_code=1.FFA.H4qd.fA8B5EQEiib4&smid=url-share
This is slightly related, not really enough for a post, but in regards to Tony noting the belief that Christians have a monopoly on decency, there was this Brooks and Capehart segment on the PBS newshour.
https://youtu.be/a2a7_mGi3yA?si=_we14pUU6ZV3FDgb
Brooks’ had some audio difficulties, so it was mostly Capehart, but before his mike went out, he had this observation
And I have long thought, if Americans see deportations of respectable families, they will finally rebel against this regime, and not just the progressives and not just Democrats, but normal people who are like, what the heck is going on here? And so that’s where we’re headed.
I’m hoping that the implication that Progressives and Democrats don’t count as normal people had someone in the soundbooth say ‘fuck him’ and shut off his mic.
I like Talarico. He is good at speaking plainly, which is a skill that I had to develop. There is a lot of value in that, IMHO.
BTW, LJ — I’m von.
whoa! blast from the past! I’ve dropped you an email!