State of the Discussion

The posts in play...

What do you mean ‘we’, kemosabe?
(4)
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Ad futurum
(17)
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Where are the 5 words?
(125)
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The DIY party
(5)
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WTF moments at cultural borders
(20)
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The comments...

wj
+ Always great to see people standing up. Of course, as soon as the MAGAts notice that people (who are not white people!) are undercutting their [. . .]

woo hoo! Great to see you Chuchundra! I'll be in touch in a couple of weeks for advice.

+ Historically, these sort of efforts (denazification, debaathfication) haven't gone so well. Lustration (the process of decommunization) was a mixed bag (Czechoslovakia good, Poland and Hungary, [. . .]
Chuchundra
+ Took me a while to find this. I thought someone owned an obwings domain that redirected to the typepad site and maybe it would be [. . .]
wj
+ to get back to anything like a pre-Trump normal, we’re going to need some kind of national de-MAGA-fication. We will need to root the bastards [. . .]
wj
+ The oath to the Constitution is pretty deeply ingrained in that culture, especially the higher up you go. And, importantly, the higher up you go [. . .]
russell
+ And the final target audience is the military. The military at this point is the last guardrail. If they flip, it's game over. And as far [. . .]
russell
+ Still, looking at where we were in, say, the early 1800s, I’d say that we’ve made significant progress over the last two centuries. I'll try again, [. . .]
wj
+ I'd say the target of the "excuse" is, first, all those people who generally don't pay attention. The military going into an American city [. . .]
russell

"Knowing that Gay is second-generation *Haitian*".

I do miss the preview. Now I'll have to start paying attention to what I write!

:)

russell
+ Russell is a bit more familiar with Leslie than I am, but I have to ask, is his taking issue with Gay on civility related [. . .]
Tony P.
+ CharlesWT, thank you for responding, and thank you for the content of your response. It's a good start toward civility when we can [. . .]
+ Well, we are probably at the end of the line for talking about this, but I do subscribe to Descartes line that "the heart has [. . .]
wj
+ the failures of the local authorities to enforce the law and ordinances So, are you expecting the police to successful arrest every criminal? Because [. . .]
CharlesWT
+ what would you want the Guard or the Army to actually do? I don't want them to do anything. Trump shouldn't be mobilizing the National Guard [. . .]
GftNC

TonyP: I meant on the blog! But, FWIW, I am in general completely in sympathy with your approach.

Tony P.
+ wj, I don't know about you, but "20-30 years from now" there's a good chance I will not be around to "look back". One [. . .]
Michael Cain
+ Before that, it has been Italians, and before that the Irish. At our nation’s founding the boogie man was the Germans.... I won’t be astounded [. . .]
GftNC
+ ps By the way, I completely agree with what Pro Bono says @11.44. And, about Ian Leslie, on reading more of his Wikipedia [. . .]
GftNC
+ Ah, I think I'm finally getting what you mean by "a stake" in this context, lj. If I understand correctly, you mean that people [. . .]
wj
+ I think that the constitution could be saved, but it would take another Lincoln or FDR to do it, .... Of course both ended up having their [. . .]
wj
+ wonkie, I would note that, at least in the US, the pattern has included an additional phase: the group of outsiders is moved into Our [. . .]
bobbyp
+ ...thought I'd pass this on to those of you who like to assess our current political travails in light of wider themes: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/10/05/opinion/west-europe-america-lost.html?unlocked_article_code=1.rE8.064G._2GkKn5zEX4W&smid=url-share Resillience is [. . .]
+ Nous and Pro Bono are having a much more interesting conversation about what shape post Trump America could take if it were to avoid running [. . .]
+ I've read a good bit of Gay, (my daughter recommended her book Bad Feminist which led me to her other books) but Ian Leslie wasn't [. . .]
Pro Bono
+ That’s because you are seeing Republicans as people who have a different worldview and position, and trying to understand them in order to live with [. . .]
Hartmut
+ Oh, I forgot the 'clear and present danger' doctrine that Hitler invoked after the 'Night of the long Knives' and that has also been a [. . .]
Hartmut
+ The Nazis never officially abolished or even changed the Weimar constitution. Elections still took place (with of course only one party on the ballot) etc. Hitler [. . .]
Hartmut

It's improbable that 'bought the farm' comes from here but it's the literary illustration of it:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_Much_Land_Does_a_Man_Need%3F

Hartmut

Quite an old one that:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo_homini_lupus

nous
+ bobbyp - I read your link and I will admit that I have thought the same thing about our situation more than once. I think that [. . .]
CharlesWT
+ About a decade and a half ago, I used to pursue and comment on a form similar to this one. One of the regular participants [. . .]
russell
+ Here’s another breakdown of the protestors. Seems sort of accurate. I was glad to see the "outcasts" included because they are almost always part of [. . .]
wj
+ In the example of Afghanistan (and other Islamic countries), a lot of justification of confronting those countries is based on their approach to the rights [. . .]
bobbyp
+ Are we there yet? https://outsidethebeltway.com/has-the-constitution-failed/ Are we really to get our panties in a bunch based on the (cherry picked) actions of a small number of anti-fascist [. . .]
+ About stakes, we all have our individual ones. A lot of people seem to have a stake in the I/P conflict that demands they support [. . .]
wj
+ Another oddity: "turn and burn." Reputed to originate regarding air force dog fights. But the most common occurrence, in my experience, regards truckers (or [. . .]
+ A bit of color on your comment. Japan is interesting (and this transfers to other places) in that if you went back to before Meiji, [. . .]
GftNC
+ But rather than pretend that we will reach agreement, I think civility demands that we accept that there are going to be points that we [. . .]
GftNC
+ But since Gay starts her essay with Vance’s demand for civility, don’t you think it is a bit disingenuous to summarize Gay’s argument by not [. . .]
`wonkie
+ I think "bought the farm" for dead dates back to the days when small family farms lived precariously from one season to the next, always [. . .]
`wonkie
+ It's remarkable how recurrent the pattern is: a group exists which I will call "Our Nation". Outsiders move in. At first, when the outsiders are [. . .]
+ Sure, Leslie isn't implying that. But since Gay starts her essay with Vance's demand for civility, don't you think it is a bit disingenuous to [. . .]
nous
+ Pro Bono - But I see no reason to be uncivil. That's because you are seeing Republicans as people who have a different worldview and position, [. . .]
Pro Bono
+ ...the base of the GOP has decided that Democrats, and Democratic voting states, are on the enemy side of the friend/enemy distinction. I've decided that [. . .]
CharlesWT
+ Charles, the thing that puzzles me at least, is that if that is what you think of Trump, how is it possible for you to [. . .]
GftNC
+ nous, the "GOP and their core voters" and their base, and MAGAs, are clearly not available for civil discussion, and maybe they never will be. [. . .]
GftNC
+ Charles, as someone who has been (understandably) piled on, you certainly have my sympathy. But I pay you the compliment of hoping and believing [. . .]